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L Keegan

BOARDS AND COMMISSION VACANCIES

Beth has updated our city web site so it is now easy to find the list of vacancies on our Boards and Commission. Thank you, Beth.

Here is a link to the page:

http://www.edgewaterco.com/index....tionid=5&id=71&Itemid=101


Here is a link to the application:

http://edgewaterco.com/images/stories/forms/boardapp.online.pdf

You can easily find the vacancies also by going to the city site and clicking on the Boards and Commissions link at the top, then to Boards and Commission Vacancies:  

http://www.edgewaterco.com/
vacancies forever

why does edgewater post vacancies when we have enough applications to fill an entire board?

why does council refuse to make appointments to the CRCC, when there are more than enough applicants to fill the board?

why does a council member ask an applicant who is willing to volunteer for "any" board" to apply for a board that has an applicant for every seat instead of one with existing vacancies?

why do people get fed up with trying so hard to serve on any of these boards or commissions and finally give up?

seems a little rediculous and circular.
the way of things

don't take it personal

Hey, my husband has applied to four boards under three separate administrations and never received an appointment, not even an acknowledgement that he had applied. We sort of took it to mean the person in charge didn't want him on the board. Pretty simple. Them's the rules. He didn't take it personally.
Guest

applications

If an application is turned in, all you need to do is call the city clerk's office to make sure it is on record and she will tell you what to do from there.  Have you tried a simple phone call to the Mayor? Easy thing to do. This does not have to be a one way or no way city. Communications are always the best way to handle things.
Guest

New Faces

Quote:
why does edgewater post vacancies when we have enough applications to fill an entire board?

Because Council is looking for something other than the first five people to step up?
Quote:
why does council refuse to make appointments to the CRCC, when there are more than enough applicants to fill the board?

Because Council is looking for something other than the first five people to step up?
Quote:
why does a council member ask an applicant who is willing to volunteer for "any" board" to apply for a board that has an applicant for every seat instead of one with existing vacancies?
Because Council is looking for someone objective rather than than the same five people who stood up the last time?

Quote:
why do people get fed up with trying so hard to serve on any of these boards or commissions and finally give up?

seems a little rediculous and circular.

I would prefer to see new people not the same old pool of people serving on boards. I would like to see a waiting period between appointments so new people could be encouraged to serve and our volunteer pool could expand, instead of the same old people hopping from board to board to board. Give new faces and new ideas a chance!
Recruit for these boards, talk to your neighbors!
Guest

Yeah right.  Look at the P&R Board fiasco over the past two years.  Council continues to drag it's feet in writing the Charter mandated ordinances on ALL of the boards and commissions determining whether they advise Council or the Manager.  No B&C should be "under" the Mayor at this point yet she goes around redefining a boards duties without benefit of an ordinance that complies with the Charter.  It is one big mess with enough blame to go around.  Then they sit there and wonder why no one wants to get involved.
Guest

New Faces

Rules, procedures, red tape, politics and personal criticism don't get things done.

Willing, open minded, responsible residents do.

I suggest you can't see the forest for the trees, you are too close.
Take some time, gain some perspective, let some other residents try their hand at things and see if your opinion improves. It just might.  
Guest

What problem?

Quote:
Council continues to drag it's feet in writing the Charter mandated ordinances on ALL of the boards and commissions determining whether they advise Council or the Manager.  No B&C should be "under" the Mayor at this point


Council has been learning the new Charter and methodically applying it. They have been hiring a City Manager which is the keystone for doing the other things you mention. The Mayor was appointed "acting City Manager" until one was hired and has been working in that capacity. Everything has been by the numbers.
It sounds to me like you may not understand the transitional provisions of the Charter but that's OK, it appears to be transitiong quite well.
Guest

Anonymous wrote:
 Look at the P&R Board fiasco over the past two years.

You say fiasco - I say finally.  That particular board seems to be doing very well right now, the best its been in years.  And it has a lot of new blood.
Guest

Guest 7:15 am repeatedly wrote:
Quote:
cause Council is looking for something other than the first five people to step up?

Charter says:
11.6 Charter Review and Compliance Commission. (1) The Charter Review and Compliance
Commission is hereby established, consisting of five (5) members and one (1) alternate to be appointed by
the Council. The members shall be appointed for three-year overlapping terms, and the commission’s
duties to report to the City Council or the City Manager shall be set by ordinance.

20.2 Effective Date of Charter. This Charter shall become effective immediately upon voter approval
at the special election that shall be held for the purpose of considering this Charter

It's taken almost a year to appoint this Commission.  Anyone interested has had plenty of time to put in applications.  There are a couple of new faces in the current applicants.  There simply is no excuse for this delay.

Guest of 8:58 am
Just exactly what has this "new" P&R Board done?  Volunteer time to help the Director?  The "old" Board did that.  Has the Tree Commission (one of the P&R Boards duties) meet to set up Arbor Day or Tree City USA?  Much of what was "wrong" with the "old" Board was the Mayors doing not theirs.  I have noticed that the fence came down in Citizens Park.  Was that the P&R Boards recommendation or the threat of a lawsuit?  The "old" P&R Board recommended the fence come down years ago because they felt someone might get hurt and now someone has.  You can thank the brilliance of the P&R Director for that.  Remember the Directors response to the softballs leagues complaints against the fence..."They'll get used to it", that even shocked City Council at the time.
Nothing against the "new" Board but, there was nothing wrong with the "old" Board.  They did manage to write an excellent Tree Master Plan.
Guest

Re: New Faces

The Guest on Wed May 20, 2009 8:19 am : Post subject: New Faces pretty much said it all...

Anonymous wrote:
Rules, procedures, red tape, politics and personal criticism don't get things done.

Willing, open minded, responsible residents do.

I suggest you can't see the forest for the trees, you are too close.
Take some time, gain some perspective, let some other residents try their hand at things and see if your opinion improves. It just might.  
Guest

Guest of 8:19 wrote:
Quote:
let some other residents try their hand at things

Just as an example, the CRCC positions have been posted for over 60 days.  One citizen did go about the town trying to recruit citizens to apply for this Commission.  We had six applicants three weeks ago, we have the same six as of today.  Where are these other residents you speak of?  It would be wonderful if we had a hundred applicants but it just ain't happening.  Appoint and move on.
Guest

Regarding the P&R Board
Guest of 8:58 wrote:
Quote:
Anonymous wrote:
Look at the P&R Board fiasco over the past two years.  

You say fiasco - I say finally.  That particular board seems to be doing very well right now, the best its been in years.  And it has a lot of new blood.

For the past two meetings (April 20th & 27th) they have had Election of officers on the agenda.  It is also on the agenda for their May 21st meeting.  Three meetings and they can't elect officers?  Who's running the meetings?  The Director?  That would be a violation of Charter.  Now they are holding their meetings at 11 AM, during the day when working people can't attend.  They are doing a wonderful job.  Just the kind of job the P&R Director wants.
Guest

Meow....

So predictable.
Guest

I sure am glad that the citizens have this stick to complain on. I just love hearing the same old argument over and over and over and over and over and......
Geez - talk about 'Let's move on.'
I think that is a good suggestion for those who have done nothing but complain about the park and rec board and the council and the CRCC commission. Why is it that I don't hear these complaints anywhere else?  
The Eagles have a song that is appropriate for these conversations.

GET OVER IT!
Guest

Anonymous wrote:
For the past two meetings (April 20th & 27th) they have had Election of officers on the agenda.  It is also on the agenda for their May 21st meeting.  Three meetings and they can't elect officers?  Who's running the meetings?  The Director?  That would be a violation of Charter.  Now they are holding their meetings at 11 AM, during the day when working people can't attend.  They are doing a wonderful job.  Just the kind of job the P&R Director wants.

Your ignorance is only surpassed by your anger.  Reading the agenda hardly counts as paying attention, and what ever made you imagine that the director was running the meetings?  Duh - the properly elected Chairman is running the meetings.
Guest

Hmmmmm.   Someone touched a nerve.
Guest

Quote:
Reading the agenda hardly counts as paying attention


OK,  so..........do minutes count?  I'm at work at 11:00 AM so I guess I'm left with minutes.  Do they have minutes?  I haven't found them on the Cities website.  Guess I will have to file a FOIA form to get them if they exist at all.  Good job.
Guest

A Public Records Request if far less dramatic but much more efficient.  They are available at City Hall.
Guest

P&R Agenda

Parks and Recreation Board
May 21, 2009
11:00AM
City Hall
Conference Room
2401 Sheridan Boulevard
Edgewater, CO 80214

AGENDA

1. Call to Order
2. Roll Call
3. Pledge of Allegiance
4. Approval of Agenda
5. Mayor’s Comments
6. Appointment of New Board Member
7.      Election of Board Officers
8.      Presentation by Parks and Recreation Director, Lydia Hamilton  “Parks and Recreation funding sources, facilities and equipment inventory and existing IGA’s available for 2009 summer youth programs.”

9.      Board Discussion of Possible 2009 Summer Youth Programs

10. Discussion of Upcoming Agenda Items

11. Director’s Comments

12. Board Member Comments

13. Set Next Meeting

15. Adjournment

Public comment is welcomed at all points noted on the agenda.

Lets see, Approval of agenda, Mayors comments,  P&R Director gets to speak twice, election of officers.  Where is the approval of the minutes from April 20th or 27th....................gee it isn't there.  Maybe because there aren't any.  That explains why they have forgotten who they elected as Chair, Vice Chair and Secretary.  Boy, the Mayor straightened this Board out, a duty that is no longer hers, if we follow the Charter.
Guest

No approval of minutes here:

April 27, 2009
3:00 pm
City Hall
Conference Room
2401 Sheridan Boulevard
Edgewater, CO 80214

AGENDA
1.      Call to Order
2.      Roll Call
3.      Pledge of Allegiance
4.      Approval of Agenda
5.      Mayor's Comments
6.      Interview of Applicant
7.      Board Recommendation to the Mayor Regarding Applicant Appointment - Should be done by a proper motion and a vote.
8.      Possible Appointment of New Board Member
9.      Election of Board Officers
10.    Discussion of Possible Summer Youth Programs
11.    Discussion of Upcoming Agenda Items
12.    Director's Comments
13.    Board Member Comments
14.    Set Next Meeting
15.    Adjournment

Public Comment is welcomed at all points noted on the agenda.

No approval of minutes here either:

Parks and Recreation Board

April 20, 2009
6:30 pm
City Hall
Conference Room
2401 Sheridan Boulevard
Edgewater, CO 80214

AGENDA
1.      Call to Order
2.      Roll Call
3.      Pledge of Allegiance
4.      Approval of Agenda
5.      Mayor's Comments
6.      Interview of Applicants
7.      Board Recommendation to the Mayor Regarding Applicant Appointments - Should be done by a proper motion and a vote.
8.      Possible Appointment of New Board Members
9.      Possible Swearing In of New Board Members
10.    Election of Board Officers
11.    Discussion of Upcoming Agenda Items
12.    Set Next Meeting
13.    Adjournment

Public Comment is welcomed at all points noted on the agenda.

And what about the Tree Commission?  Are the trees out of vogue?  I have to tell you, I am impressed with the Mayors all new and improved P&R Board.   I can't wait till she takes over Council meetings.
Juanita Freeman

To Guest of Thu May 21, 2009 11:20 am

To Guest of Thursday May 21, 2009 11:20 AM, You seem to be drawing some pretty broad conclusions that may not be based in factual information.
Should you have a problem with the Parks and Recreation Advisory Board, why don't you call one of them and ask them about your concerns? I'm certain any one of them would be glad to listen and address your issues.
I sit on the board and I would be happy to talk with you.
As a citizen advisory board we are your voice with the Parks and Recreation Department and we want very much to hear from the residents of Edgewater. We also welcome you to bring your concerns to our open meetings.
We haven't met as a board but twice since last summer and yes, we are in the process of assigning tasks, electing officers and getting organized so there may be a few discrepancies in our process. My apologies.
I'm not sure why you feel compelled to take up all these column inches copying and pasting our agendas but please call and let's see if we can help resolve your issues. The City Clerk's office has our contact details, should you need them.
Thank you
Guest

Deadline to apply for the Charter Compliance and Review Comm

Is it too late to turn in an application? Does anybody know?
Guest

For what position?
Guest

Sorry.  Didn't look at the post line.  I think they are taking apps till June 11, 2009.
Guest

too late?

to apply for the Charter Review and Compliance Commission, do you fill out the regular City application or is there a diferent one?
Guest

Re: Deadline to apply for the Charter Compliance and Review

Anonymous wrote:
Is it too late to turn in an application? Does anybody know?

CHARTER REVIEW AND COMPLIANCE COMMISSION

Applications are being accepted through Friday, June 12, 2009 until 5:00 pm for voluntary positions on the Charter Review and Compliance Commission.  This Commission consists of five (5) members and one (1) alternate to be appointed by the City Council. The members are appointed for three-year overlapping terms, and the Commission’s duties to report to the Council or the City Manager are set by ordinance.

Qualifications are as follows:

• Registered elector.
• Resident of the City for at least one (1) year immediately preceding the date of appointment.
• Not an elected official, officer, or employee, board or commission member, or member of the Fire Department.
• No conviction for embezzlement, bribery, solicitation of bribery, perjury, subornation of perjury, or any offense involving fraud.

Functions of the Charter Review and Compliance Commission.

(1) The Commission has the power to hear all complaints alleging non-compliance with the Charter, including allegations of willful Charter violations, subject to limitations and requirements as established by ordinance.  Any complaints involving the Commission or members thereof are heard by the City Council in the manner provided in Section 7.5(2) of the Charter.

(2) The Commission forwards any findings of willful Charter violations to the City Attorney for possible prosecution in the City’s Municipal Court pursuant to Section 19.8 of the Charter.

(3) The Commission reviews the Charter at least once every six (6) years after adoption, and at least once every six (6) years thereafter, for possible amendment. In addition, in the form of advisory resolutions, the Commission presents its findings to the Council regarding complaints of Charter non-compliance.  Therein the Commission might provide suggestions for possible clarification or revision of the Charter to address ambiguities or inconsistencies that it has identified.

Posted: May 12, 2009
Published: May 14, 2009 Wheat Ridge Transcript
pleased to see this

Hospitable Invitation to join a Board or Commission

I was happy to see this inviting and informative little blurb on the City website encouraging residents to sign up to volunteer for a City board or commission. Thank you, whoever wrote it. It makes the idea of volunteering for the City a lot less scary. Good work!
It reads:
Boards and Commissions Vacancies
VACANCIES ON THE CITY OF EDGEWATER'S
BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS
Do you ever find yourself sitting around with time on your hands?  Do you say you have been watching too much TV lately and getting bored with the same old programs?  Is it too early to begin planning your vacation, but you just know you could be doing something worthwhile?


Well, the City of Edgewater needs you!  All cities need volunteers to serve on boards and commissions.  Most require only one or two meetings a month.  All you need is a desire to serve and make your City a better place to live.


The City Council establishes boards and commissions by ordinance.  The ordinance establishing any board or commission prescribes its powers and duties; specifies its duty to report to the City Council or City Manager as appropriate, and identifies the department head who will act as the board or commission's liaison. All boards and commissions have powers and duties that are advisory only, except as otherwise provided by law.  Except as otherwise required by the City Charter, all board and commission members are appointed by the Mayor.  Qualifications to serve on a board or commission are as follows:


Registered Elector
Resident of the City for at least one (1) year immediately preceding the date of appointment.
Not an elected official, officer or employee of the City, a member of the City Fire Department or a member of the Police Department Reserves.
No conviction for embezzlement, bribery, solicitation of bribery, perjury, subornation of perjury, or any offense involving
Fraud.

Currently, there are openings on the following boards and commissions:


Board of Adjustments and Appeals
Historic Landmark Preservation & Arts Commission
Parks & Recreation Advisory Board
Public Safety Advisory Board
Charter Review & Compliance Commission      Edgewater Redevelopment Authority

Applications may be found on the City's website, www.edgewaterco.com, or obtained from the City Clerk's Office.
Guest

It's the same app for the CRCC as for other B&Cs.
Guest

Re: Deadline to apply for the Charter Compliance and Review

Anonymous wrote:
Is it too late to turn in an application? Does anybody know?


Actually, you can submit an application for any open Board seat at any time. If a deadline is posted, and they have enough to fill the board, I suppose you could be turned away.

An interesting point to notice however - the CRCC was fully loaded with 6 applicants following the first notice for applicants and deadline, so one can only wonder which council member's idea / agenda it was to post this with a second deadline when they had ample opportunity to fully seat the board.

Be careful who you vote for this November friends. Know who will support the public and who will run with their own agenda. It's not too tough to figure this out.
Point of clarification

The CRCC applications did not total 6 as of the deadline. There were only 4. In order to accept the other two, the deadline had to be extended and posted. This is one of those legal issues that Cooke was talking about last night. Let's not go looking for trouble where there isn't any to be found. You want accountability, there it is.
further clarification

so even if 2 of the 6 applications were received after the deadline- why could council not appoint the board with the 4 that met the deadline and the other 2 for the remaining 2 seats on the date in April as originally scheduled?

normally, postings for open board seats are updated and posted by the clerk with no deadline. there is no legal requirement to post an open board/commission seat.  this seems to be another of cooke's legalistic tactics to dealy the act of council doing business, frankly it seems because he is afraid of being held accountable.  his answer- delay it until he resigns.  I just wish the rest of council would see through this guy.  guess he wants to go out with a bang!


bye bye cookie!
       
Guest

now chilldren...

Only one day after finally getting a real adult, ah, I mean, a City Manager and we are bickering already, tsk, tsk, tsk.
Hold on.
The end of June isn't far away and I have a plan. What we need is a board game where you get to pretend you are running the city. It can be designed and handed out to everyone and we can all play at running the city in the comfort of our homes and invite over our least favorite neighbors and have lots of fun playing "Edgewater". Meanwhile, the City Manager can manage  the City!
I promise, a board game for everyone with dice, and neat little statuettes of Councilmen and Charter Commissioners and Chairmen and flash cards with titillating topics like "posting requirements for boards and commissions for 200 points"! Oh joy! It's going to be loads of fun!!!
I will be able to sleep at night knowing my neighbors are no longer in charge and for those who just can't stop themselves from playing "Edgewater" there will be a nice, harmless board game. Finally. Wheew...and Yeeeeehaaa!  
Guest

further clarification wrote:
..... why could council not appoint the board with the 4 that met the deadline  ....

Apparently council didn’t like they what they saw.  Counidl is not bound to appoint someone just because they filled out an application.  The mayor has the same right with other boards and commissions.  No one can assume that just because you applied you will be appointed - no matter how many vacancies may exist.
Babe

Qualifications and appointments

Quote:
No one can assume that just because you applied you will be appointed - no matter how many vacancies may exist.


This poster is correct and to the point. Just because you apply it doesn't mean you are qualified. And hey, even if you are qualified you may not fit into the mould of the appointing authority, be that mayor or council. Them's the breaks. It is elected officials appointing, and it is their idea of the direction for a board or commission that will prevail. If you don't like their vision for the direction of the boards or commissions then you have one of two choices - change the charter again to have someone else do the appointing (maybe you'd like B&C members elected?) or you can vote out the mayor and council and vote in those who share your vision of the direction for the B&C's.
There are obviously some disgruntled CRCC applicants posting here who can't understand that they don't fit the vision of the Council for how they want to see the CRCC shaped. In the short run, you folks might want to find surrogates to file for these positions and then you can act as mentors if those folks are accepted.
It's Edgewater - stranger things have happened.
In the meantime, remember Einstein's definition of insanity as providing the same input but expecting a different result. Or, for you more erudite readers, reference Eldridge Cleaver to Wm F. Buckley on Crossfire, sometime in the early 70's, regarding winning and losing elections.
Or maybe songwriter Mark Graham's interesting lyrics apply - "Life is hard, but life is hardest when you're dumb. You wait for years but inspiration never comes. With a negative IQ you'll be lonely, sad and blue. Yes life is hard, but life is hardest when you're dumb".
My apologies to those these words don't fit, my condolences to those they do!

And as Mr. Graham also wrote - "Have a Nice Day"!  
STICKLER

Qualifications...breath here.

Guest at 6:10 pm

So, just how much is the Heritage Center? What's the rent,  and with a motel? Just how close to go is it located? Do I have to supply my own dice?
I think the community chance should include: quotes from the past with the results.  Councilman Gardener..."anyone willing to walk the fine streets of the City can be on Council".  (I don't disagree)
The other is former Cooke's comment in regards to Council  is just "doing it as a hobby". Anyone drawing such a card should win automatically, quit or sit in limbo til the residents have no other choice but, reinstate you.
Just because you fill an application...not only does it not make you qualified it possibly brings up those naughty little crispy fried burnt bridges.
Surprise!!!
Welcome Mr. Stalf
More Stickey

Quote:
And hey, even if you are qualified you may not fit into the mould of the appointing authority, be that mayor or council. Them's the breaks. It is elected officials appointing, and it is their idea of the direction for a board or commission that will prevail.

Or maybe they just don't like the idea of the CRCC and are stalling.  How would they know if a person fits their "vision" for the CRCC till they hold interviews.  They have had almost a year to seat this Commission, there is more at play than some childish popularity contest being held by Council.  A City Manager can't fix the political antics but he can insulate the administration of the City from it.
It's time some of our elected official grow up and stop acting like this is a middle school student council.
point of order

Correction and education.

We....................have no middle school is this town. Mr More Skickey?
What do I know?

Elected officials have a responsibility to preform their duty whether it is passing of an ordinances or seating boards and commissions.  Political shenanigans have consequences.  For example consider the following link to an Op-Ed piece published in the Denver Post Saturday May 23, 2006.  It is worth reading.
http://www.denverpost.com/opinion/ci_12432000

This is an agenda item that was acted on this past Thursday by Council
Executive Session for the Purposes of Determining Positions Relative to Matters that May be Subject to Negotiations, Developing Strategy for Negotiations, and/or Instructing Negotiators, under C.R.S. § 24-6-402(4)(e) Regarding City Manager Selection and Hiring and with Respect to the Purchase and/or Sale of Real Property, and to Discuss the Purchase of Certain Real Property by the City and the Sale of Certain Other Real Property by the City, Under C.R.S. § 24-6-402(4)(a).

In light of 20th & Depew and the sale of the Police facility, it would seem prudent to inform the public of what Real Property and for what purpose.  The actual terms of negotiation are of course best dealt with in executive session and are protected by C.R.S. § 24-6-402(4).  It would also be prudent of them to seat the CRCC ASAP before someone files a complaint and there is no Commission to hear it.  That could turn into an expensive legal battle.
STICKLER

Here is a sock.

I think I can gather most of Edgewater on this one. When I say "stick it".  Get a life. Move on. Ya missed boat.  What's that?
ENOUGH,
Go back to Middle/Junior High and learn what Memorial Day is about.
not from around here?

naive conclusion

Quote:
How would they know if a person fits their "vision" for the CRCC till they hold interviews.  

I'm pretty sure every knows who everyone is, without interviews.

You always provide your own dice, but you can play without dice, a lot of people do.
Guest

CRCC issue

I have something to say about this controversy of the CRCC. I served on the Charter Commission and regardless of my reservations about the CRCC it did pass as part of the Charter.
Personally, I don't feel qualified to serve on the CRCC because I did serve on the Charter Commission. The most vocal supporters of the CRCC expected to be appointed to this commission. This commission they created. I have problems with that. It is like hiring yourself for a job you created on somebody else's dime.
If the CRCC is a viable, useful idea Edgewater shouldn't have  difficulty finding new eyes and ears to populate the commission, once the community understands what it is and why it exists.  
I suggest the concept of the CRCC be a subject of more communty education and out- reach. I doubt the majority of Edgewater residents even know what it is. After a time of public education if Edgewater residents, who didn't serve on the Charter Commission don't support the Commission by volunteering for it then it may say something about whether Edgewater citizens find the commission useful and, consequently, it says something about it's long term viability.
What you do about that, now that it is a part of the Charter, is another topic, entirely.
Guest

Guest of 11:25 makes good sense. There are a lot of assumptions going on in this topic. The ones that make sense are that council is not required to appoint anyone just because they apply for a position on the CRCC.
Another is that there is a legal responsibility to accept only those applications that were submitted within the posted time. If more applied after, then the posting must be extended in order to allow those who late applications.
I like this last posters idea about public education on what the CRCC is supposed to be. I do know that there are people who were on the formation committee who fullly intended to be on the CRCC. This does present a conflict. And, in my opinion it showed in the meetings. I would suggest that there be a term or two between CRCC formation committee members serving on that committee and actually serving on the CRCC.
I fully expect council to be as professinal in choosing this board as they were in choosing the city manager.
Guest

Public education, it is important.  Here are a couple things I think people should know.  If someone (most likely someone on council) is found to be in violation then a report is sent to the council and the manager - Whooptido!  If someone (most likely someone on council) is found to be in willful violation then the city attorney, who is hired and fired by the city council, will be given the opportunity to either press charges against their boss or not to press charges against their boss.  The whole thing makes no sense and it is attracting some of the most angry people in Edgewater politics.  I say get rid of it.
Guest

Anonymous wrote:
Public education, it is important. The whole thing makes no sense and it is attracting some of the most angry people in Edgewater politics.  I say get rid of it.


You may have something here.
Farmer Scott

Guests?

Oh, my goodness.  Thanks alot, Honorable Mrs. Laura Keegan.  I'll bet you were just doing a friendly little PSA to get more help from the community.  Well, now you've done it.

I served on the Charter Commission and I don't remember anyone named Guest or Guests...I must have been reading or caught up in the mind numbing arguing.  What a fantastic way to be introduced into the fun world of Edgewater politics.  Not quite sure to blame myself or those who signed my petition.

As for the CRCC:  I voted for it. What an idiot (not really). If, I can explain.  I feel that elected officials should be held accountable and not neccessarily just at the ballot box or recall, both of which take time and money.  Given Edgewater's previous management and leadership. I certainly found the existance of this Commission to be reasonable.  In addition, to the onging review of the Charter which, I feel is a great idea. Knowing what I know now, the citizens chosen to write a new Charter are faced with a very daunting task under strict timelines.  Having accumulated/ongoing information from history can only result in an easier and superior final product.
So what now.  Well, I feel that this commission should be held to even a higher standard. Remember, they have to comply with 7.5 of the Charter also. I think Council should seat this Commission as soon as possible (but, not immediately) my guess is there are other pressing issues.  If this Commission does not work for the betterment of the City, I'm sure our great citizen's will see fit to have it removed in short order.  Nothing ventured nothing gained.

Slam away,
The Farmer
   
Guest

It isn't that simple.

Quote:
Here are a couple things I think people should know.

I would just caution anyone to look a little deeper into this issue than the pat explanation presented by this poster. Maybe read the Charter yourself, rather than allowing a faceless, nameless person to interpret it and ferret out the meaning for you.
This is a Talking Stick weakness. No one has to support their argument with facts, no one has to quote their references, that is unless you require them to do it.
Farmer Scott

Catch my clue.

Why look, its another guest. Probably another genious from the Chater Commission I bet?  If, you didn't know it, The Farmer has rather large ears and a long neck which he will stick out on occation however, his eye sight sucks and is getting worse daily.   I looked diligently for this quote and couldn't find it.  It had better be on this thread.  Or, you have bigger problems than the City's communication (which sould always be looking too better itself).
Please, give a time and a name (guest or not) and location. Bitchin' has way better impact when people know what yur refurin' to.

Damnit Keegan,
Your Farmer
   
Forever Guest

OK Farmer

Farmer, what would we ever do without your evenhanded, tongue- in- cheek, take no prisoners, sense of humor?    Here ya go...and I'm sorry for taking a quote out of context. signed "Forever Guest"
Guest said:
Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 11:06 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote:
Public education, it is important. Here are a couple things I think people should know.  If someone (most likely someone on council) is found to be in violation then a report is sent to the council and the manager - Whooptido!  If someone (most likely someone on council) is found to be in willful violation then the city attorney, who is hired and fired by the city council, will be given the opportunity to either press charges against their boss or not to press charges against their boss.  The whole thing makes no sense and it is attracting some of the most angry people in Edgewater politics.  I say get rid of it.


and to quote some poet"A simple truth is nothing but a lie."

I feel if we ask our city attorney to investigate some impropriety and he or she doesn't do it they risk more in terms of loosing their professional credibility than if they don't examine the accusation, even if the investigation would be against "their boss", so to speak.
It is a way to shine a light of transparency on questionable behavior, of which we have known plenty in the past. Maybe that is all it would accomplish., would be to lay the issue on the public table for scrutiny. Maybe that is all it needs to do to keep people honest.
Right now, for example, Council seems to be coming close to exploiting executive session and some light shined on this situation of land transfer discussions we know nothing about may be appropriate, if we had a CRCC. This would be a way for the community to check, to question them. Right now all we can do is whisper among ourselves. We got nothin' to compell them to tell us what property they are considering and for what. It might be a great idea or it might be a very unpopular idea. I don't know, and that's the point. I don't know.
The CRCC is an imperfect vehicle. I will be the first to admit, in many, many instances I wish the Charter Commission had done some things differently but the Charter is law now and now isn't the time to pick it apart. That time has passed. Let's see if it flies, if it doesn't fly right we will go about the business of repairing the wings. I just don't think ex- Charter Commissioners should serve on the CRCC, they have too much invested, they are biased. We need a new set of eyes and ex-Charter Commissioners should stop re-debating what has been signed into law, by the way.  This brand of ambivalence is really self destructive.
Thank you. Your job is over. Walk away. It's someone else's job now.
Strictly my opninion.
Forever Guest
Guest

Re: It isn't that simple.

Anonymous wrote:
I would just caution anyone to look a little deeper into this issue

CITY OF EDGEWATER
ORDINANCE NO. 04 - 09
SERIES OF 2009
AN ORDINANCE ADOPTING A NEW ARTICLE 16 OF CHAPTER 2 OF THE EDGEWATER MUNICIPAL CODE CONCERNING THE POWERS AND DUTIES OF THE CHARTER REVIEW AND COMPLIANCE COMMISSION
WHEREAS, pursuant to Section 11.7 of the City of Edgewater Home Rule Charter (“Charter”), the Edgewater City Council (“Council”) is directed to establish, by ordinance, limitations and requirements under which the Charter Review and Compliance Commission (“Commission”) shall hear alleged complaints of noncompliance with the Charter, including allegations of willful Charter violations; and

WHEREAS, pursuant to Section 11.6(1) of the Charter, the Commission’s duty to report to the City Council or the City Manager shall be set by ordinance; and

WHEREAS, Section 11.7(2) of the Charter provides that the Commission shall forward any findings of willful Charter violations to the City Attorney for possible prosecution in the City’s Municipal Court pursuant to Section 19.8 of the Charter; and
WHEREAS, Section 19.8 of the Charter directs the Council to define by ordinance what constitutes a “willful violation” of the Charter and to set appropriate penalties for such violations that are not inconsistent with the Charter; and

WHEREAS, Section 19.8 of the Charter provides that the penalty for any willful violation of the Charter may be imprisonment for a term not to exceed the maximum term of imprisonment that the Municipal Court is authorized to impose, fine in an amount not to exceed the maximum fine that the Municipal Court is authorized to impose, or both such fine and imprisonment; and

WHEREAS, in determining how to define what constitutes a “willful” violation of the Charter, the Council has considered the provisions of Part 5 (titled “Principles of Criminal Culpability”) of Article 1, Title 18 of the Colorado Revised Statutes (such Title being known as the “Colorado Criminal Code”; and

WHEREAS, the Council desires to adopt a new Article 16 of Chapter 2 of the Edgewater Municipal Code to address and implement Sections 11.6, 11.7 and 19.8 of the Charter.

NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT ORDAINED BY THE CITY COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF EDGEWATER THAT:
Section 1. The Edgewater Municipal Code is hereby amended by the addition of a new Article 16 of Chapter 2, titled “Charter Review and Compliance Commission” to read in its entirety as follows:

Article 16.  Charter Review and Compliance Commission

Sec. 2-16-10.  Creation.
In accordance with Section 11.6 of the Charter, the Charter Review and Compliance Commission has been established.

Sec. 2-6-20. Hearing Complaints; Process.
(a)  Pursuant to Charter Section 11.7, the Charter Review and Compliance Commission (the “Commission”) shall hear all complaints alleging noncompliance with the Charter, including allegations of willful Charter violations.  Each complaint alleging noncompliance with the Charter shall be made in writing and on a form provided for such purpose by the City Clerk.  Each such form shall be completed, in all applicable parts, before the Commission may conduct a hearing concerning the complaint.  The Commission shall not make findings concerning alleged noncompliance with the Charter and/or a willful violation of the Charter until the Commission has held a hearing to consider the same.

(b) The procedure for hearing, determining and reporting on all such complaints shall be as follows:

(1) The Commission shall set a date, time, and location for a hearing;

(2) No such hearing shall be held until the party against whom the complaint is made (“Charged Party”) has been charged and notified in writing of the hearing and the opportunity to be heard; no such notice of hearing shall provide for less than fifteen (15) days between the date of service of the notice on the Charged Party and the date of the hearing, and each such notice shall state whether the charge is one of willful violation of the Charter and be personally served on the Charged Party;

(3) The Commission shall conduct its hearing on alleged noncompliance with the Charter as follows:
a. The party making the complaint (“Complaining Party”) shall read the charges against the Charged Party on the record;
b. The Complaining Party shall present witnesses and/or his or her own testimony regarding the alleged noncompliance;
c. The Charged Party, if present, shall have the right to question the Complaining Party and any witnesses presented by the Complaining Party;
d. The Charged Party, if present, may present witnesses and/or his or her own testimony in response to the alleged complaints; if the Charged Party desires to present his or her own testimony in response to a complaint of a willful violation of the Charter, the Commission shall first advise the Charged Party of his or her right to remain silent and of the fact that his or her testimony may be used against him or her in a court of law;
e. The Complaining Party shall have the right to question any witnesses presented by the Charged Party and the right to question the Charged Party if the Charged Party presents his or her own testimony in response to the alleged noncompliance; if the Charged Party is questioned by the Complaining Party in connection with an alleged willful violation of the Charter, then the Charged Party shall have the right to refuse to answer any question on the grounds that the answer may tend to incriminate him or her;
f. The Commission may question any witness and/or the Complaining Party; the Commission may question the Charged Party if the Charged Party presents his or her own testimony in response to the alleged noncompliance;  if the Commission questions the Charged Party in connection with an alleged willful violation of the Charter, then the Charged Party shall have the right to refuse to answer any question on the grounds that the answer may tend to incriminate him or her;
g. No public comment shall be taken at the hearing; and
h. Both the Complaining Party and the Charged Party shall be provided an opportunity to make a closing statement or argument to the Commission, and the Charged Party shall be provided with the last such opportunity.

(4)  In no instance shall a member of the Commission act as a Complaining Party or as a witness before the Commission; in the event that the person alleged to have failed to comply with the Charter is a member of the Commission, or in the event that the Commission is alleged to have failed to comply with the Charter, then the complaint shall be heard by the City Council in the manner provided for in Section 7.5(2) of the Charter

(5) At the close of the hearing, the Commission shall, by a vote equal to or greater than a majority of the entire membership of the Commission, and based on a preponderance of the evidence, determine whether to: (1) make a finding of noncompliance with the Charter; (2) make a finding of noncompliance with the Charter and of willful violation of the Charter and to forward the same to the City Attorney for possible prosecution in the Municipal Court; or (3) make a finding that there was no noncompliance with the Charter, or that the evidence presented was insufficient to determine whether or not there was compliance with the Charter.

(6) The Commission shall, within fifteen (15) days of such determination, issue written findings of fact and conclusions to the City Council and the City Manager in the form of an advisory resolution.  The resolution so issued shall be for purposes of review only.

(7) Pursuant to Section 11.7(2) of the Charter, the Commission shall forward any findings of willful Charter violation to the City Attorney for possible prosecution in the City’s Municipal Court pursuant to Section 19.8 of the Charter.  Findings of non-willful Charter noncompliance shall not be prosecuted.

Sec. 2-16-30. Willful Violations of Charter; Penalty.
(a)  For the purposes of this Article, a person acts “willfully” or is “willful” with respect to a violation of the Charter when the person is aware that his or her conduct is practically certain to result in a violation of the Charter.
(b) It shall be unlawful for any person to willfully violate any provision of the City of Edgewater Home Rule Charter.  A conviction for a willful violation of the Charter shall be punishable only by a fine.  Upon a person’s first conviction for a willful violation of the Charter, the fine imposed shall not exceed five hundred dollars ($500.00).  Upon a person’s second conviction for a willful violation of the Charter, the fine imposed shall not exceed seven hundred and fifty dollars ($750.00).  Upon a person’s third or greater conviction for a willful violation of the Charter, the Court may impose a fine equal to the maximum fine that the Court is authorized to impose.

Section 2. Severability. If any section, paragraph, sentence, clause, or phrase of this ordinance is held to be unconstitutional or invalid for any reason, such decision shall not affect the validity or constitutionality of the remaining portions of this ordinance.  The City Council hereby declares that it would have adopted this ordinance and each part or parts hereof irrespective of the fact that any one part or parts be declared unconstitutional or invalid.

Section 3. Repeal.  All other ordinances or portions thereof inconsistent or conflicting with this ordinance or any portion hereof are hereby repealed to the extent of such inconsistency or conflict.

Section 4. Safety Clause. The City Council hereby finds, determines, and declares that this ordinance is promulgated under the general police power of the City, that it is promulgated for the health, safety, and welfare of the public, that this ordinance is necessary for the preservation of health and safety and for the protection of public convenience and welfare, and that this ordinance bears a rational relation to the proper legislative object sought to be attained.

Section 5. Effective Date.  This ordinance shall become effective five (5) days after final publication.

PASSED AND ADOPTED ON SECOND READING AND ORDERED PUBLISHED this 5th day of March, 2009.
Taxpayer

My opinion

Quote:
Right now, for example, Council seems to be coming close to exploiting executive session and some light shined on this situation of land transfer discussions we know nothing about may be appropriate, if we had a CRCC. This would be a way for the community to check, to question them. Right now all we can do is whisper among ourselves. We got nothin' to compell them to tell us what property they are considering and for what. It might be a great idea or it might be a very unpopular idea. I don't know, and that's the point. I don't know.

Seems to me that's the point.  But then, I could be wrong. I mean, why shouldn't council tell all of Edgewater what they are doing in regards to their negotiations? It's not like anyone in Edgewater would tell the other party, right? And it is our tax dollars that they are playing with. Dammit! We have a right to know what kind of negotiating tactics they have in mind. I won't tell anyone. Will you?
I don't care if they are required to make the deal public and open to public comment after they negotiate and before they actually make the deal. We didn't elect them to do anything other than ask us what we want and then to do it. Seems to me that they ought to stop thinking for themselves, read the talking stick and listen to us - the taxpayers.
That's just my opinion. But it's paid for with my taxes. Right?
Guest

No one is asking for the details of the negotiation, only what we are negotiating on and why.  It is our taxpayer dollars they are spending.  Of course we could buy up another property like 20th & Depew, we all know how that one turned out or not.
Guest

To taxpayer

Quote:
Seems to me that they ought to stop thinking for themselves, read the talking stick and listen to us - the taxpayers.

I would answer,yes. Yes, that is exactly what we want you to do. Deflate your sense of entitlement, seek out the desires of your constituents and represent their interests. The idea that you are somehow smarter than the rest of the community by virtue of your being elected to office is, well, laughable and potentially harmful. It's time to come back down to earth.
Sorry.
Guest

I believe that council has said all that they can on this. Cooke told the public that council is currently looking at proposals for an appraisal for properties that are under consideration for the police station.
Now we can assume that council is hiding important information form us or we can assume that council is withholding information from the 'general public' in order to effectively carry out the negotiations.
I think that in 'representing the interests of the public' council would be acting inappropriately by opening this up to the public until they had the information and advise that they need to negotiate with. You don't lay all your cards on the table before you place your bet.
Farmer Scott

Thank you.

Would you look at that, as plan as the nose on my face.
I looked all over last night trying to find that quote and kept forgetting what is said. Remember its only a short drive to crazy for the Farmer.

Thank you Forever Guest,

Let the saga continue,
The Farmer
   
Guest

Interesting in theory, but a blind bet is a blind bet.

If you want to buy and sell land, especially publicly owned land, AND avoid any public disagreement, you go about it the way you are going about it.
As I recall, there was something mentioned about not only the purchase of private land for a police department but the selling of public land, as well.
We want to know which piece of our property are you selling. What makes this secret squirrel deal any different from the one when the geniuses on Council sold the police dept. in the first place, if you keep it secret?
Don't you sense just the slightest bit of hypocracy there?
This is public process, it is supposed to be messy!
Doesn't anyone learn from history around here?
Guest

How can the council represent our interest in an exchange of land if they don’t know our interest?  They haven’t given anyone an opportunity to even say whether or not we think their actions are prudent, politically motivated or just desperate.  I’m guessing this is just another desperate grab at some piece of land that will cost us god only knows what.  Who knows?  Maybe we will be leasing space for the fire department next.
JamieMac.

Assumptions

This is quickly turning into a whole lot of assumptions. If the previous councils have been less than honest about some dealings, then it goes without saying that this council will too?

Being on this council and knowing what is going on in the executive sessions, I am confident that what we are discussing up to this point - and likely past this point to some extent - is not corrupt, illegal, or misrepresenting the public. Beyond that, I can't do anything but ask you to quit speculating about what might or might not be happening. Everyone who has ever been a witness to government dealings knows that nothing happens overnight. I am quite sure when I say that this city council is trying to do their best for the city.
The Harlander

I would like to weigh in on the CRCC appointments.  Some have written here that it would be wrong to appoint members of the Charter Commission to the CRCC.  I do not see in the Charter where previously being an elected official is a disqualification for serving on this Commission.  To exclude former Charter Commission members from consideration is nothing less than prejudice against a class of people.  History has shown us that prejudice, for whatever reason, is wrong.  Serving on the Charter Commission should neither be a requirement for or exclusion from being considered for this service.
In fairness let me just state that I was an elected Member of the Charter Commission and now seek appointment to the Charter Review and Compliance Commission.
Guest

A few observations about process - take it or leave it.

No one doubts your intentions, Councilwoman McElhany however
you might have explained to this community what your plans were before you ever entered into negotiations, that is the way to prevent speculation.
To do everything behind closed doors, which is not the norm and then ask the community not to speculate about it is unrealistic and the more you argue for secrecy the more people will wonder why. That is human nature.
For the record LOTS of things have happened overnight in Edgewater and those folks probably had good intentions too.
Keeping the public informed is part of the job, whether or not you like it or respect it - or them.
Lack of respect for the public's right to know has gotten many people in trouble before. Often times they didn't even see it coming. I'd hate to see that happen to you. Keeping things open is the best way to prevent it.
I'm sure this Council has good intentions but how you present your work is equally as important.  Trust is something you earn.
Guest

OK - so if council is supposed to be open about absolutely everything that is going on, then what is the purpose of executive session?
Guest

What should/shouldn't Executive Session be used for?

Anyone care to weigh in on this?
Guest

Words like absolutely and everything are a bit overly inclusive to be useful, but your point is a good one.  Executive session is allowed for discussions that are confidential in nature such as legal advice, personnel matters and negotiations.  This only makes sense.  What doesn’t make sense is council’s tightly held secret on the locations and proposed use for a couple of pieces of property.  For all we know the city is negotiating the whole city to be used as a huge liquor store.

I think the Guest of May 26th @ 11:32 summed it up well.

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Seems to me that they ought to stop thinking for themselves, read the talking stick and listen to us - the taxpayers.
 

I would answer,yes. Yes, that is exactly what we want you to do. Deflate your sense of entitlement, seek out the desires of your constituents and represent their interests. The idea that you are somehow smarter than the rest of the community by virtue of your being elected to office is, well, laughable and potentially harmful. It's time to come back down to earth.
Sorry.
Guest

Is it possible that there are some negotiating factors that require that this information not be released yet?
Guest

Unless eminent domain is to be used I do not see why locations and use cannot be revealed but not terms of negotiation.
Guest

Quote:
I do not see why


And that, of course, makes it wrong - no matter what the pros have advised.
Guest

which pro's?
Observant

The pros that do ALL of  the thinking for Council of course.  The Mayor doesn't have any pros, and it shows.  Does any of this make any logical sense?
What we think we know:
Council is looking for a home for the PD and Possibly the FD.
Council has no money (not for a PD & FD anyway)
The City owns lots of property
Put two and twelve together and you get an idea of where they are headed, kind of, in way, sort of but maybe not or so.  It's on old Cooke thing, kind of funny but not.  Now it's a Gardner thing.  Whatever that is.  I hope it ain't a McNulty thing.
Guest

If I are the citizens who attend open meetings, expecting to learn how things are going in their town, then yes, information hoarding from I is wrong.
If some variety of professional is telling you otherwise, without a damn good reason (i.e. eminent domain) then they are wrong too.
If you won't provide information to the citizens then "because a pro says so" is not a good enough reason.
If you can't provide the information because if you do this negative consequence might result: ________________________(just fill in the blank) then that is different. These "pro"s should be able to fill in the blank.
If there is a good reason that's all we need to know but we do deserve to know at least that much and it is your job to keep us informed.
Oh yeah, the reason "to avoid public dissent" is not a good reason either. Think positive. If you don't tell us, we can't support you. Support feels great. Give it a try, that is, if you can.
EW Rock

Quote:
Oh yeah, the reason "to avoid public dissent" is not a good reason either. Think positive. If you don't tell us, we can't support you. Support feels great. Give it a try, that is, if you can.

That's the ideal for sure.  
Council and to some degree the newly identified Mayor are the Ultimate Board and Commission.  Jamie and Kent will be soon enough the Senior members.  Adam has stated that he will not run for office (or will).  Five seats open plus the Mayor.  Hummmmm?  Do I want to be on the CRCC or Council, maybe even the figure head Mayor?   Six open seats in November and six open seats on the CRCC.  That is a total of twelve significant offices to be filled.  Beggars can't  be choosers, I say.  Seat the Commission so they don't run for Council or Mayor.
Only in Edgewater!
Farmer Scott

Oh really?

Hey, Mod; The Farmer is mine...Right?
Yo Edgewater, Good job.  Way to pay attention. We now have 7 pages of


I'm sure you heard the one about "What do you call a bommerang that won't come back".

I think its time to wait to make outlandish assumptions. It is what it "is".  Why would I ever call any of our Council persons and tell them what I think when I don't even know the question is. We are having a change in Leadership no doubt about it.  Think (Transitional).  August...September...October I think are enough months to really mess up again, so we can start the ride all over again.

Dumb stick,
The Farmer
   

PS. The Harlander is going for the CRCC...Oh, really.
Guest

transition yes, start all over, no

How soon we forget. We have a City Manager! We won't have to start all over anymore, there will be someone at the helm while the townspeople play musical chairs. I just hope we have the humility and the wisdom to wait until he gets here to help before we make any big decisions. This is the one Pro, we should listen to.
Nighty night Edgewater.
Guest

The City Manager is an administrator not a legislator.  He can't solve it all.  Kind of like making a silk purse out of a sows ear.  We can complete the "transformation" this November if anyone of real substance steps up to the plate and runs for office.  As for the CRCC, way to much is being made of that whole deal, after all, they are only advisory at best.
Guest

However, this is the last Council who should feel compelled to both legislate and administer which has always been the problem. Now they can return to their correct role and leave the administrative/project management tasks -  such as negotiating real estate deals - to a proper manager, the guy with real world experience and skills so we (at least I HOPE) we don't have bookkeepers, bakers, brewers and mailmen pretending to be urban planners, real estate brokers and development project managers anymore. (even though I know it is really fun to play those roles, we have proven it isn't good for Edgewater)
All they have to do now, is get briefed on a project, debate it's merits and decide whether or not to appropriate funds. Why they might even have time to write their own ordinances and realistically that is plenty for citizen volunteers to do. It's about time Edgewater allowed their City Council to perform their duties as legislators and stopped trying to turn them into something they were never intended to be. I'll pass on the sow's ear, silk purse analogy.  
Guest

Quote:
It's about time Edgewater allowed their City Council to perform their duties as legislators and stopped trying to turn them into something they were never intended to be.

That may be a hard habit for some of them to break, micro managment is a favored sport of Council.
Guest

Agreed

- and although elected EW residents always have had big-headed problems with their authority and serious blurring of boundaries, it is my hope that this City Manager will know when to gently tug on the reins and bring them back to their own job descriptions, because he will know what their job description is even if they don't quite understand it.
Guest

Quote:
because he will know what their job description is even if they don't quite understand it.

Hopefully true.
Guest

There is an opening on council. All of you who feel you can do what council is supposed to do, not be judged as arrogant, micro-managing, secretive, etc., etc. etc......
step up.
Guest

I'm sure someone will, just like people have stepped up to be on the CRCC.
Guest

Council opening

all you have to do is not be arrogant, micromanage or keep secrets from the public, really not that difficult, please do step up
Guest

It's really amazing that there hasn't been one to fit those qualifications in years!
Do you think that they lie to get on council, and they are really planning to screw the public? Afterall, it is $300 a month!
I'm thinking that must be the case, and all of us who vote for them are not very smart.
Politics

I'm sure most have the best intentions but there is a little orientation that goes with the job.  DRCOG, CML and others.  Not that those are bad organizations but there is a bit of them (the public) VS us (the elected officials) that goes with it.  Our litigious society can shoulder a part of the blame for this situation.  And then there is the simple fact that you can't please everybody so if you can't stand the heat, get out of the seat.
$300 bucks a month over four years buys a new low end car or a high end entertainment center and there are a few other perks that go with the job.  Like rubbing elbows with the real shakers and movers.
One reason

Not to run for Council

Whatever they have, it might be highly contagious.
Guest

semantics

I believe the saying goes, "movers and shakers" but you know, it's just semantics
A writ of reason

Any lawyer could tell you that.  Try a 1983, that was Cooke's favorite in response to the CRCC.  Whatever a 1983 is.  It's all a part of the game, a game it is all to easy to get caught up in.  Why in the world would anyone want to serve on Council or the CRCC is beyond me.  They can't even enforce the laws they pass, unless they want to, for personal reasons.  That is the Edgewater way.  What ever happened to reason?  It was lost a long time ago in the Swamp.  Lots of luck with the Manager thing.

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